I-44 Expansion

As the plan is now in session... I really hope they decided to buy and demolish the Camelot... Please get rid of it...

user posted image

Inside the Camelot

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That could be a primo rehab, you know...

It could have been... now it just sits there every day, untouched and kids keep breaking the remaining glass on the hotel... Would it cost the same to buy it and rehab it or just tear it down and build a new building...?

I wonder what is still left in there... Always been trying to find someone to give me a tour in there... Look's creepy and mysterious...

The Skirvin sat that way for 20 some years.

I really think the Camelot is a diamond in the rough.

The Skirvin --- But that is in Downtown...

Camelot is next to a Charlie’s Chicken two pawn shops, and Cici's pizza... Maybe there is a chance and turn it into a 3 star hotel for the area... A Holiday Inn would work out fine there...

But we must save the sign...

QUOTE

I have a question I've always wondered... are the environmental impact studies really worth all the hoopla, or is it just more red tape to improving a deadly section of freeway?

Well, EISs are required by the government. Their main purpose is to help mitigate impacts on the environment (bugs and bunnies and wetlands and things of that nature) and historical/archaeological features. The EIS also takes into account the effect a project, such as a highway, would have on low income groups. Some examples of things we have had to contend with are Indiana Bats (I believe they are endangered or threatened), historical properties, cemeteries, wetlands, floodways/floodplains, mobile home communities, prime farmland, noise impacts, and angry opposition (I actually received a threatening phone call and I know one day several protestors actually spray painted on the State House "no I-69", plus one of the six project offices was vandalized by protestors). I am not sure why the protestors are attacking the consulting firms. All of the firms were hired by the state to find the best alignment for the highway, taking into consideration all the things I listed above, as well as trying to mitigate the impact on businesses and homes. We do not take a stance (pro or con) for the road. They might not even build it after we determine a preferred alternative. That is their prerogative.

So it's much more rounded than I would have expected. I've seen where there were actually multiple studies done, rather than an all-in-one, but I've thrown away the records as those are so old...

QUOTE (bluedogok @ September 12, 2006 09:04 am)

QUOTE (Warren @ September 12, 2006 01:43 am)

Not exactly. Typically they have 3 or more firms compete for the design. The winning design will be selected in ~1 year from now, and that firm will be awarded the right to design the corridor. That does not mean the firm will be awarded the construction contract. That will also under go a simular competition and selection proccess later on in the proccess. Useally only one construction company wins the contract for construction. For major construction corridors such as I-44, a huge company like Kewit Construction (Omaha, NB) that CAN handle the project or a consortium of companies will win the contract for construction. Right now, they are ONLY in the design phase. They also have to complete an Enviroment Impact Study (EIS). The design will have to reflect the EIS findings and reconmendations. The EIS proccess can take up to 3 years to complete. Only then may the final designs be completed (taking another year or more so we're at 4-5 years from now). Then construction may begin, if funding has been secured. That company will often sub-contract out different parts of the project to other companies to accelerate construction.

Sorry, I know how these projects are put together in Oklahoma. I worked for one of the companies doing a segment for 11 years and my dad was a highway designer there for almost 35 years.

There will be one coordinating contruction company, but Oklahoma does not normally do a design-build type of arrangement, everything is bid at construction. It is also not a "design competition" in the traditional sense, each team will design a segment as noted. The consortium type of team is more common in super projects like The Big Dig in Boston or the T-Rex project in Denver, it is not that common in Oklahoma. Although it is a complex project, this project is not as big and complex as those and will probably be let in the normal manner.

okay, my bad. I have not followed many large construction projects in Oklahoma. I am very familier with major construction projects in major cities across the country such as the "Big Dig-Boston" and "T-REX-Denver", "TRAX-Salt Lake City", etc,... I was lead to believ by the artical, that this was a large project (Minus Mass Transit), such as the fore-mentioned projects. Design-build would be the best, most efficent and cheapest way to complete this project--with todays soaring cost in commodities such as Concrete and steel. Sorry to sound arrogant!

What do you guys think of adding commuter rail service and stations along the frieght rail line in the medium of the BA Expressway from DT Tulsa towards Broken Arrow?

Yes Rail Line--- That was one topic we forgot to add... I really approve the rail line.. It well be a great benfit and I belive more people would use it then riding the bus...

Cool, I started a thread to discuss Commuter Rail options for Tulsa!

Thanks--- So anyone drive on the new bridge yet... It looks good and can’t wait for them to finish I-44...

They haven’t opened all of Skelly Drive but it is going to be two-way traffic now until you get to the shopping center and then its back to one-way... This well help out a lot for those businesses...

QUOTE (Warren @ September 13, 2006 11:26 pm)

okay, my bad. I have not followed many large construction projects in Oklahoma.

No problem, as I stated I grew up in the business there so I know a bunch of the back story. I hated the math in school so I went the architecture route

These are large projects for Oklahoma, especially considering its donor state status for 20+ years but it is not compared to those other monsters. For the most part the funding has always been doled out in small yearly portions so that is why it seems like a big project. The bid type of model has worked well for a long time on projects of this scope.

For a Big Dig type of project I do agree there is a need for a coordinating company and the D-B works best for those. Although, it has not been the solve-all in that project but there is so many involved there is more than enough blame to go around. Hopefully the T-Rex won't come back on Kiewit like the other has on the Big Dig companies. As Oklahoma County found out with the jail, your oversight is only as good as the people doing the checking. In the end it pays to do it right.

I hope this thing doesn't end up like the Big D

It shouldn't, there are no tunnels under a harbor involved.